catapult magazine

Read this issue’s Bible study verses: ../issues/backIssue.cfm?issueid=26#study

God used many processes in the Old Testament to teach the Jews. Does God still use this method today? Why are these processes significant?

God no longer uses the methods in the stories listed for study this issue because Christ has come. Christ claimed that all the many processes in the OT all teach one thing: Christ. All the processes God used teach us in so many ways about Christ and what he came to do in our behalf.

The coming of Christ also explains why authoritative revelation no longer occurs and why miracles no longer normally happen. Miracles gave authorization to revelation and greatly aided the early advance of the gospel. In Christ revelation itself reaches culmination; what more is there to teach than Christ and him crucified? What more is there to learn than resurrected Christ? God has now finally spoken by his own Son (Heb 1). Finally, Christ sent the apostles; apostles means “sent ones.” In early NT times this term referred to someone sent in another person’s name with power that he could not pass on to others. Hence, Paul has apostolic authority, but does not (cannot) pass it onto Timothy.

More can be said here, but that’s all for now.

I think that God does still use processes to teach us. It seems like most of the passages listed are also tests of the Jewish people. In church today I heard a sermon about Abram, and his life of lasting impact. God tested Abram, so that his faith would increase, and blessed him.

While today’s tests or processes aren’t necessarily as dramatic as those in these passage, I’m sure people out there have lots of stories with similar themes. One of the things that struck me about these processes though, is that they’re communal. I can think of processes in my own life through which God has taught me, but I have a harder time thinking of times when an entire community has been tested like this…I’m sure there are situations like this though. Does anyone have an example?

I’m not really sure that Christ’s arrival would negate this kind of learning…It seems to me that it happens, but it might not be shared with large groups of people.

I agree with the thought that God’s process of working in our thoughts and lives is communal. I have recently been thinking about how much these discussions on *cino have helped me to think through certain issues and I’ve become more aware of the fact that I couldn’t learn anything without others.

I too have been challenged by *cino’s community thinking. It’s wonderful to find a home for ideas and thoughts.

I suppose I was confused by the meaning of “processes.” I think the difficulty of the question posed is that each of hte processes recorded in the Bible verses involve something supernatural. I have never experienced anything supernatural (this does not preclude the possibility of such events). Thus I can’t say that I have learned from processes like those recorded in our Bible verses.

I’m not sure what “God’s process of working in our thoughts and lives” means either. If it means God’s incredible providence (opening/shutting doors, providing food and company at the right time), who could deny such experience? If it means experience of the fellowship of the saints, again, what Christian wouldn’t claim such a process of God acting. If it means the process of sanctification, God working powerfully to transform lives and thoughts, again, I’d agree. Perhaps we just need to define “process” more carefully.

All I’m arguing is that God no longer odinarily works by revealing himself apart from Scripture or by allowing extraordinary miracles to be performed.

What does “supernatural” have to do with this? I don’t understand what you mean when you say that God used “supernatural” processes in the Old Testament but not in the New Testament or no longer today.

i think God definitely uses similar processes to teach us. (for one thing, the process of communion is still tied directly to the passover).

and the process of learning to trust—like when we’re marching around our jericho on day 6, thinking, what the hell?

i liked the story of the linen belt. as i was reading it, i was imagining what was going to happen to it after he buried it. (is it going to turn into a snake? sprout a giant weed to give him shade?) after all, if the lord tells you to bury your linen belt, something amazing is bound to happen. then he digs it up and it’s rotten. beautiful!

Here’s the principle in action. Communal learning! I’m torn between two positions. I agree with laryn that God still uses similar processes today. I can offer a concrete example. When I was at Dordt, I was jolted at the end of one semester by news that the Iowa tuition grant ran out of money and that I wouldn’t receive it. I had counted on that grant money and was forced to drop out. It was frustrated. I didn’t see the point. I was promised that if in subsequent years the Iowa tuition grant had a surplus, my debt would be paid. Needless to say I didn’t hold my breath. I dropped out of Dordt and moved back to Dallas.

Sometime later, however, the money did come through! I was shocked. In retrospect I can see how it gave me time to reconsider my studies. When I entered the university, I took a different course of study. God shut a door, but opened another. He also taught me not to rely on myself. I laughed at the thought of my debt being repaid by a government institution. Yet, God had the last laugh. The government gave me money!

So that’s one position. These processes do still happen. On the other hand, if we miss the uniqueness of OT revelation and the difference between the way God taught in processes then and the way he does now, we fall into moralism. The story about Jericho reminds us to persevere. There are similarities between our experience and those in the OT, but there are also profound differences.

This is where the supernatural comes in. If we miss the supernatural in these stories, we flatten them out. In a sense, how can we miss the supernatural in these stories! What child would miss it? Walls falling down, the Lord killing all the firstborn of Egypt, belts withering. All this is to say nothing of the Lord speaking directly to his people. God himself not only gives the processes but interprets them. There’s no question as to their significance. I received no direct revelation that interpreted my experience at Dordt. Why does God no longer speak directly to us, interpreting our life experience? Why does God no longer regularly perform miracles among us? (Note: I did not deny that miracles occured in the NT times; only that they do no regularly happen today.)

There’s a tension in the narrative that collapses the moment we miss the uniqueness. The tension is meant to drive us to Christ. All the OT teaches us about him, and in Christ all the promises of God are Yes and Amen.

How can these two positions be resolved? I believe in a couple ways. First, there is a miracle, mighty act of God to save his people, that God commands us to celebrate today, just as he told the Israelites to celebrate the passover. We celebrate Christ’s resurrection in the sacraments: the Lord’s Supper and baptism. Also, he interprets that event, just as he did in OT events, through the preaching of the Word. Finally, each Christian is in a sense a supernatural work in progress. These are the normally reocurring supernatural phenomena of the NT era. They are the most similar processes in our lives today that I can think of.

I think the significance for us of the processes God used in the OT to teach his people centers on providing so many foils to Christ that teach us in a variety of ways the rich perfection and significance of Christ. To gain the most from the OT, you have to understand the uniqueness of the text itself (What did God teach?), how that text finds fulfillment in Christ (What does God continue to teach about the sort of Savior we need?), and finally, how do we apply it to our lives (How does the Holy Spirit minister Christ, the culmination of all righteousness and revelation, to us through that text in the process of sanctification? In other words, how are we to live grateful lives now by the power of the Holy Spirit in the light of that passage?).

It’s a bit simplistic for every OT text, but I think it’s generally useful.

what i liked most about the linen belt getting rotten was that it was exactly what you would have expected after burying it in the ground and coming back many days later.

in some sense i dislike trying to nail down what “processes” God is using, because we come from such a limited perspective and are often wrong.

The belt may have rotted in a completely normal way, but it would be utterly meaningless unless God had commanded it and interpreted it. All I’m saying is that we don’t get such an interpretation today.

I also have no wish to put God in a box. However, understanding how and why God works, and why he works in different ways today, is not something abstract. Knowing these things is personal, just as God is personal. One might ask, “Why doesn’t God care enough to give me such intense experiences?” simply because we assume God normally operates the same way throughout history. Some Pentecostal friends become dishearted because they have never spoken in tongues.

I’m not advocating limiting our perspectives needlessly. This can also be dangerous. But its one thing to limit God and another to understand why he acts the way he does from his own mouth, as it were. God interprets not only actions immediately after he performs them, but also suggests reasons he acts differently during different eras in history. Understanding these things is very practical and even comforting.