catapult magazine

my flatmate just announced with great enthusiasm and display that she is giving up sugar for lent. i think the act of giving something up for lent a bit odd particularly in the case of my flatmate. she is a self-proclaimed believer in nothing, except herself, science and mankind (minor caviats). so why would she want to give something up for lent? is lent merely a pretext to make up for a lack of self-control the rest of the year mixed with severe guilt backlash? i, er, pointed this out to her in my ever tackful :D way, which for someone who claims she doesn’t offend easily she seemed … , well, it is best that she is just my flatmate for the next few months and not someone i plan to live with forever and ever.

i’m curious what other cino* folks think about people who give up something for lent but in no other way practice xnity or believe in what lent points to? do you give something up for lent or do anything behaviourally distinguishable from the rest of the year to prepare for easter? personally, i favor going through the special set of prayers for the season in my prayer book in preparation for easter; what do you do?

that’s an interesting angle on the discipline, Greg. I agree that many observe Lent out of obligation to religion, rather than out of an overflow of the heart. such observance doesn’t nearly approach the life-changing denial that Christ experienced in the desert that the practice is modeling itself after.

I’m interested in this distinction you make between "biblical" practices and non-biblical practices. what makes a practice biblical? what defines a "practice" for that matter? why is a biblical practice more desirable than a practice that was cultivated after the canon of Scripture was written?

that’s an interesting angle on the discipline, Greg. I agree that many observe Lent out of obligation to religion, rather than out of an overflow of the heart. such observance doesn’t nearly approach the life-changing denial that Christ experienced in the desert that the practice is modeling itself after.

I’m interested in this distinction you make between "biblical" practices and non-biblical practices. what makes a practice biblical? what defines a "practice" for that matter? why is a biblical practice more desirable than a practice that was cultivated after the canon of Scripture was written?

"Biblical practices" are things the Bible specifically tells us to do, such as presenting our bodies to God as living sacrifices, which is our reasonable service. If we do this, then we will refrain from doing things such as smoking, drinking alcohol, eating unhealthy, not exercising….all of which is medically proven to be harmful to our body.

These are some of the things I’ve seen cathlics give up for lent…things that Christians should not be doing in the first place.

I know numerous cathlics and they practice things that their church tells them to that the Bible does not tell believers to do. Like, praying to Mary instead of directly to the Father in Jesus name…which is what Jesus instructed us to do.

Jesus also said that the traditions of men cause the Word of God to be of no effect, becausde these folks put their traditions above what God says. Jesus had a serious problem with people like this.

Basically, these religious traditions such as lent are things that God has nothing to do with and should never be placed above God’s Word as though He told us to follow these traditions.

Sorry but I think I missed the part where lent was placed over the Word of God.

Greg, what sinful things exactly where your Catholic friends giving up for lent? pornography? murder? It’s easier to have a conversation if there are specifics to work with.

Sorry but I think I missed the part where lent was placed over the Word of God.

Lent is a religious tradition. God did not terll us to do this…but many act as though this is something God expects us to do.

Kinda like praying to Mary…God never told us to do that, therefore we have no business doing it. This is how religious traditions make God’s Word of no effect, because people start ignoring what the Bible says and do what their pointless religious traditions say to do.

Needless to say, God does not honor religious traditions.
He has nothing to do with things like lent.

The only lent I have anything to do with is in my clothes dryer :lol:

Greg, you seem to be assuming that God stopped communicating with us entirely when the authors of the Bible were through writing, confirming Nietzsche’s observation that Christians operate as though God is dead. And that, it seems to me, is far more unbiblical than an observation of lent modelled on Jesus’ 40 days in the desert before he began his work.

Well, all I can tell you is that the people that practice lent and other religious traditions today…are just like the people that practiced religious traditions back in Jesus’ day.

You remember those folks? The ones that said we are THE people of God, and those that aren’t in agreement with us are infidels? Ring any bells coming from the cathlic church???

Jesus said people like this were of their father…the devil, and the works of the devil they will do. He was basically saying these folks were all about show…but their hearts were far from God.

Not much has changed…

You seem to be unable to comprehend that Lent—a tradition modelled on the behavior of Jesus (a perfect example of what it means to be [i:6119c8372f]human[/i:6119c8372f])—can be a winsome practice contributing to right relationship with God and others. Yes, Lent, as is the case with all human traditions, has sometimes been practiced poorly and to ill effect, but that doesn’t discount the discipline as a whole.

Greg, here are some other examples of important things Christians do that aren’t required by, and in some cases aren’t mentioned in the Bible:

1. Pray before meals
2. Have sermons and sing songs in church
3. Have daily devotions
4. Have accountability groups
5. Get married by a pastor
6. Celebrate Easter, Christmas, Pentecost, Thanksgiving etc

But, the Bible does teach that we should do all in the name of Jesus, so we do need to honor Him.

Many cathlics drink, smoke, cuss, commit adultry as though it’s OK…becauser they can go down to their "father" down at their church and get forgiven.

They just don’t have good bliblical teaching down there at the cathlic church.
I know quite a few of them, and most have no clue that Jesus said we must be born-again to be saved…they have no clue because the priests are teaching another gospel….the gospel of catholicism, which is an un-godly cult based upon the religious traditions of men!

ah, greg, you are making some interesting points about hypocrisy in the church. 1. how many pursue activities when done in excess, e.g. drinking and smoking, are detrimental to one’s health, relationship with others and one’s ability to live a faithful xn life. 2. then there are instances where there are those in the church willfully pursue activities which the Lord forbids, e.g. committing adultery, as if doing such has little impact on one’s life and the lives of those around them.

i know, however, that those activities and the abuses of xn freedom are not catholic issues alone, but regularly happen amongst protestants as well.

in fact, i happen to know quite a few protestants who in the name of jesus and an odd tradition of what is and is not "american" advocate the death penalty for minors and the mentally disabled. oh, and lets not forget the protestant groups who support, in the name of jesus, state sanctioned torture! :D

as an aside, this is an interesting story on evangelical allegiences
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5502785

greg, on a less critical note, i am at a bit of a loss to understand the nature of your frustration with catholics, catholicism, and religious tradition. a number of the abuses aside, i happen to find lent and the preparation it entails for good friday/easter to be a highly instructive and useful spiritual excercise. it is an opportunity for a mindful act of self-discipline, something which the bible repeatedly advocates.

when did practicing spiritual self-discipline become wrong?